Divorced Life

[pt_tangles]

In reading a thread in NFP today (This One if you're interested), I was struck by the number of people who chimed in with some varient of 'My religion/being Pagan doesn't influence my charity work/political views/views on community/etc'. I seem to remember reading a thread about this not too long ago (damned if I can remember where, tho).

It makes me wonder how common a view that is. Is it something inherant in Pagans to have their spirituality divorced from the rest of their lives? Do your beliefs not influence or impact your life outside the altar room?

For myself, I hold the spiritual beliefs I do because they are a part of who I am as a secular person. My religion isn't really something that I can think of as 'seperate' from my day to day life. There are some disconnects ... there are some situations where I don't feel comfortable being 'the real me', but I strive to integrate those times, and they are a lot less than they were.

I am me. Religious me ... Secular me ... it is all me. Thoughts?

--Phae

I will prolly X-post this to a couple of places.

Comments

[pjvj.livejournal.com]

>>>'My religion/being Pagan doesn't influence my charity work/political views/views on community/etc<<<

I find that unfathomable. However, we have Sunday Christians, so why not Sabbat Pagans?

[pt_tangles]

I suppose, though, that would make the majority of the folks at NFP just like the folks at TC, and that kind of makes me sad.

I dunno, maybe 'Pagan' is coming to mean something else that has nothing to do with spiritual belief and/or practise?

--Phae

[pjvj.livejournal.com]

Maybe. Or, it could mean that Paganism has become melded to them over time and there is no flashing red light connection in their mind between their specific spiritual beliefs and their specific political, community, etc. beliefs. I'm not certain if I'm being clear. When being Pagan was new to an individual it is more like a new shirt and you feel all its edges and seams and exactly how it fits. As it becomes more a part of you it is more like skin and if you think of it you know how it holds everything else together, but your awareness of it as seperate diminishes over time.

Maybe the influence isn't truly missing, just the conscious awareness of it, is.

[pt_tangles]

I guess I can see that ... so, they are remembering where the edges *were* as opposed to actually considering the question anew?

--Phae

[pjvj.livejournal.com]

I think they are no longer aware of the edges and it is all mixed together for them.

[pt_tangles]

Ok, now I am confused. If they are no longer aware of where things are seperate and everything is mixed together, how can they even make the claim that the one has no bearing on the other?

--Phae

[pjvj.livejournal.com]

LOL. I think it is so intermixed they are no longer aware of the influence it has on the other parts of their life. Not in a your-too-stupid-yourself way, but in a fully integrated, so much a part of them, they do not see a direct cause and effect relationship between them.

I see what you are saying, but I'm thinking along a different line. My way, the people are quite advanced in the "melding process". Perhaps I'm giving too much credit to too many pople for being that "evolved"?

I don't hold parts of myself so sepaerate, so consciously making the direct link from pagan belief---->political stance isn't so clear cut. I can do it, but I've become accustomed to my spiritual beliefs being such an intregal part of who I am as a whole person that I have to really think to say what belief lines up with up with what issue in many cases.

And you could just be right. Maybe Pagans divorce their religious beliefs from their other beliefs with a cold hard line.

[pt_tangles]

Ah, ok, I think I get that ... so it's kind of like people reacting against the idea that 'being Pagan' is *the* reason for what they do and think (as if it were the only reason). Where as if I were asked if my religious views influenced my political/societal views, my response would be 'of course, it is a part of who I am'.

Just different interpretations of the question.

--Phae

[pjvj.livejournal.com]

Yeah, kinda like that. It may be a very simple thing such as society puts less value on beliefs that stem from religions than on ones that stem from "pure logic", so in essence they are saying their beliefs are right because of logic over faith or what have you just to be taken seriously.

I really think people are more intergrated than they often believe. Short of mental issues it is pretty impossible to have one set of beliefs live completely independent of all others done to the subconscious level.

[firefly124.livejournal.com]

Hmm, I may say things like that sometimes, but not because I feel the two are separated. More like I feel the causality is reversed. I am the type of Pagan I am because that is what resonates with my beliefs about charity work, politics, whatever. Yes, my Gods give me orders sometimes, but I wouldn't be listening to Them if Their types of orders weren't consistent with my beliefs about what is a right and good way to live in the first place.

[pt_tangles]

I came to the faith that I have because of the beliefs I already held as well, but what I learn as I grow on my path directly effects my beliefs on society and all that jazz ... either re-enforcing them, developing them, or changing them (or all three). I guess it leads me to question what Pagan faiths are about?

To my mind, they are about growth and development of the soul (as are just about all religions). Perhaps I am missing something (which is entirely possible ... this could be an issue that I have just taken for granted before).

--Phae